Do I really need a track bike?

Hello Gavin,



Hope I caught you before you left. I quit selling motorcycles December 31st. It was basically time to reduce the load, so I'm only doing service work and hopeing to be able to ride more.

 

Gavin....

I'm confused :? ; if you're perfectly happy with your 749 as a track bike and looking for a Monster for the street, why would you be considering a 1098, unless you want to be the first (and probably only!) idiot to let me test one at the track? :lol:

Bobby B.

 

I think it sounds like his 749 is a track only bike, but he wants something he can side on the street, hense the interest in a Monster. The 1098 would then be his only bike for track days and street rides. Did I get this right?



Not sure how many overnight street rides you'd want to do with a 1098. Not exactly a long distance machine, comfort wise that is. Also remember that it's a totally new model. Not to trash Ducati's relability, but I would be leary of any new Italian model in terms of reliability, especially at the risk of getting stranded far away from home.

 

Wow, for not wanting to trash Ducati reliability, you should did a great job of it. :lol:



The first year thing always made me laugh. The first year is often the best and purest, with subsequent models often gaining weight and becomeing more "user friendly" to appeal to a wider audience. Think '86 Gsxr vs. '88 or '91.

 

My '95 SS SP has never left me stranded, and it's seen plenty of long distance rides. Then again, Mike takes really good care of it when it's in for service.

 

Hey Mike,

you might want to check out the 96 GSXR, 97 TL, or 99 Hayabusa. All new models, all recalled for serious issues.

 

Hello Papa,



There are also models that developed issues later after being "improved." Frames that are less straight after a year or two of production and models that had issues in the first year that were never corrected. 916 rocker arms had no issues until the third model year for example. Then there was Interceptor front end tuck in the early eighties. Not corrected until the redesign in '86. Goldwing alternators. Suzuki GT750 running issues that developed after being in production for a few years.

My BSA had the improved clutch that turned out to be junk, replaceing the old clutch that had worked well for years. There are also "updates' that turn out to be nothing more than cost cutting in later years.



Personally,I rank avoiding the first year right up there with bad vehicles being built on Monday or is that Wednesday or is it the first thursday after a full moon that falls in the first week of the month, but only in months with 31days.



There is also the cynical side to this. With a new model, manufacturers often are more responsive to problems. Once it's been out a while, they've had time to develop along list of excuses.

 

Papa,



More importantly, this years wonder bike may be next years old crock when something else comes out. In our current motorcycle world "top of the heap" can become "just another heap" in a matter of months.

 

I get nervous when Mike and I agree on anything (let alone Ducati's!), but I too, am rarely nervous about first year models. Particularly in this case, where the 1098 is not a revolutionary new design for Ducati, but the result ot the evolution of a design that has indeed improved with age and with each new generation.

 

I don't know, everytime I've bought something that was a new model year, it's had issues of some sort. This goes for Japanese as well. Eveything from cars to computers to iPods, I got to learn to give a product time to mature a bit before being drawn into the hype. I truly believe companies these days are more focused on getting a product out quickly than to build it reliably. The more complex the item, the more this is true. Considering how complex motorcycles have gotten, I would lump them in this category.



As far as a stab against Italian bikes' relaibility, . . . . well that's another argument that I'm sure Mr. Brokenbones would like to chime in on. But i would think anyone who's used to them knows the imporance of regular maintenance and pays a little extra attention to to the bike's interworkings. Kind of like a Porsche owner would vs. a Toyota owner.



Mike, you are right about age not always bring quality. I've got an 05 Saab 9-3 Aero that's the biggest piece of high dollar crap I ever owned (or leased in this case) Three pages of reported problems and the thing only has 15K miles :shock: And that model has been in circulation since 99!



One thing that has me a bit nervous about the 1098 is how the can offer so much more bike for so much less money? Are they cutting their profit margins that thin, or did something else have to give? Hopefully I'm wrong and bike is as reliable as a 10 year old Yamaha FJ, but only time will tell. Again, I'm not rushing out to get anything that hasn't proven itself for at least a model year.



Now where'd I keep my order confirmation for that iPhone? :lol:

 

Hello Rich,



The 1098 is only that price in the US. It is the same price as the 999 everywhere else. The company line is; they believe we are the most important market and they want to increase their profile here. I just hope it turns out trouble free for them. I believe they have a lot riding on it. Aprillia has new a bike comeing and I would bet on some new Japanese bikes in a year or two so they have a twelve to twenty-four month window to make an impression.



Maybe you are first year gun shy because of your computer background. It seems customer is software speak for R&D. :roll:

 

Gavin,

Like last years Yamaha R1 LE, the price of the parts that make the "S" model an "S"model is pretty close to the extra money required to purchase it, and like the R1 LE, every upgrade is almost "standard" fare to anyone who wants to improve handling. The only thing I'd do is sell the aluminum Marchesinis and replace them with Magnesium one's, which are noticeably lighter.

The extra 5K for the Tri Coloure seems a little steep for an exhaust system and a couple of green and white stripes, but to me it certainly looks alot nicer; I don't like unicolor paint.

But I'll be happy to test ride any of the 3!!!!

:lol:

 

Hey Mike,



Don't get me wrong, I never hesitated buying a first year anything. ZX-9R, 96 GSXR, 98 R-1, 00 RC51, I did not worry regardless of the brand. The only "mature" brand-new bike I ever purchased was my 93 V-Max. Anything else that wasn't pre-owned was either a first or second-year model. And actually, two of the second-year models replaced first-year models that had been crashed or stolen. But objectively, there is no denying that Suzuki has (had?) a tendency to put out first-years models that have problems.



The flip side of the coin is that buying a second year model would sometimes result in getting a castrated machine. That was true of my 96 and 97 GSXRs (the latter needed a full race exhaust system and jet kit to keep the bone stock former in sight). That was also true of the TL before and after recall (Joe Cappelli had one).

 

Hello Papa,



Like the man said; " you pays your money and you takes your chances." I guess we can win or loose either way.



I too had an '86 GSXR 750 and it seemed faster than the '87 model. The really good one was the 1985 model that we didn't get here in the US. It came with cable operated carbs instead of CV carbs and was an absolute rocket. A racer I new from Batavia NY had one. It was fast and bullet proof. The pipe he had on it was an ear splitter and with what was then astronomical revs it sounded like it would shatter glass coming down the front straight at Pocono.



You gotta wonder. Where does the speed go in some subsequent models?

 

and then there is Suzuki changing the valve spring keepers on the GSXR-600s to a less expensive material (cast aluminum vs forged?) so that one engine wouldn't last one 24 hour endurance race, guaranteed. I forget what specific model years but it was somewhere in the late 90's in to the early 00's. Even if the previous years bike was slower the newer one wouldn't finish, at least not under WERA stock rules. In that case the earlier ones were better too.

 

Let's not forget the ever-decreasing quality of the welds on the Gixxers - I saw some pics of a 600 that recently broke in 2. A nice clean snap at the welds with clear evidence that there was virtually no weld penetration.... someone needs to reprogram those robotic welders...

 

Hank,



Did you hear about Colin Edwards having his M1 chassis crack in testing? :shock: Really.

 

Yeah, I read about that... probably due to so much chatter it shook apart :roll:



He really needs to go back to WSBK where his riding style would actually match the bikes and he would actually have a chance at stepping onto a podium... A great ridier, just not a great MotoGP rider...