You know what's cool. I'll make the rules for drain plugs how I see fit. That's cool. So it's going to be RTV silicone for I and A groups (FYI, we've never had an oil spill in Novice) and we will do random checks and if in violation the rider will forfeit their track fees and be sent home. Same with ethel glycol anit-freeze. That pretty much settles the issue. G'night.
This kills me the whole if its easy for you it might not be easy for someone else. I get it. So the person who can ride the wheels off his bike but can't turn a wrench we need to be sympathetic to? So how does this person change his tires when they are bald. Or change his brake pads when the wear thin. How do they change the oil before the big track day? Answer... They find a way!!! I'm sure the money they spent for the matching helmet, leathers and yes 200 dollar track day wasn't a deterrent to get on the track. Your right, this whole thread has been twisted from my first post which was an FYI and puplic service message about safety. quote from my first post... "So bottom line I know its not required (should be) safety wire the drain plug, filler cap and filter. Or at least use some silicone. Its not hard and could save you and others a lot of money and more importantly prevent injury." (did you notice it said AND and not OR?) And since I was fresh from the crash I did a little venting. Can you blame me since I'm over $4,000 in the hole? (No easy fix) Yes I accept that possibility every time I go out but it really sucks when it was so avoidable. Thats ok I'm the bad guy that doesn't pay attention, know my surroundings, and has no compassion for the mechanically challenged person that looked so sad. Yeah accidents happen and life lessons are learned. Thats really easy to say when your not in the classroom. But her I am trying to make good. I'm happy to see that this thread started some changes in the STT organization. I'm sure it will be for the better and safer operation, even though some seem to drag their feet. Again This thread was directed at the Advanced group who should know better. Its not the first time out on the track. I think Monte did a great job and I'm happy to read his post. As far as the Novice group I'm not as worried about them since STT does a great job getting them up to speed in a safe controlled manner. Maybe the first class session they should talk about and go over everyones bike. Just a thought. And for the people that need help with safety wiring I'm always ready to help. Now I hope this thread ends
I don't think anyone here is trying to dictate rules, just suggestions and circumstances. Some a bit heated than others, but no matter what, it's your business, your rules. No different than anywhere else. By the way, how well does RTV silicon work if the plug is covered in oil?
Or you could have the rule state "catch pan OR wired bolt with both recommended." Either way I can comply easily. Also I do think if the bar is raised to far for novice riders that many people will not try track days and that would be a shame. Hard call good luck.
Nope, that's called making a decision as an owner. Like it? Great. Don't, that's ok too. I/we don't make rules to be popular or unpopular. We try to have rules that allow a blend of real world enforcement and safey. RTV silicone works very well on a clean drain plug. We'll ammend tech rules to reflect this and do random I and A checks. At registration we will be asking a sampling of the A and I riders to remove lowers do we can check. We'll see how it goes and ammend from there if needed.
Kind of like airport security? Does this mean that bike brands more prone to oil leaks will be 'profiled', ie: Harley-Davidson? "excuse me Mr. Buell rider, but will you please bring your bike behind this curtain for some extra pre-screening. If you'd prefer, we can provide a Harley tech to do the inspection, if you feel more comfortable with that" Sorry, I couldn't resist. :? Too much time in airports this year.
Or you could have the rule state "catch pan OR wired bolt with both recommended." Either way I can comply easily. Also I do think if the bar is raised to far for novice riders that many people will not try track days and that would be a shame. Hard call good luck.[/quote] This is a good solution as well.
Making A an I groups remove thier lowers will essentially penalise the I group since they are first out. My guess is half will still be screwing around trying reinstall thier lowers by the time the first session is called. Coolant is checked on a honor basis, why not safety wiring? It's pretty rare for someone to be able to look an official in the eye and lie thier a$$ off. (BTW of all the bikes I've owned including Harleys and Buells, by far the worst leakers were my Yamahas....weird huh?)
David had a class for the intermediate & advance riders out here in the North-East section. I can't comment on how it went as I wasn't able to attend those dates, but it's a great idea, nonetheless. Lance
Holy Moses - this forum is by far the most dangerous part of the track day... save, perhaps, the corn dogs. To Brian's question about knowing why some made it through and others didn't: - Came around the outside of two bikes in T1. Was keeping an eye on the inside riders to make sure I gave them enough room on exit. - Saw a few bikes in the bailout straightaway, including one with smoke. Assumed... 1. someone messed up entry to T2 and a group went left to avoid a pile-up, and/or 2. someone blew a motor (may have been a 2-stoke up there making blue smoke) - Saw a bike down in the grass beyond T2. This advanced the current thinking - something went wrong in turn 2 and people bailed left. - T2 coming up quickly. Just passed guys on my left who are probably still close behind. Probably shouldn't cut left down the straightaway for fear of knocking someone else out. There was no way to know if someone was on my left rear trying to get the inside of T3. Can't make out whether there's oil to the left, anyway - that could be the trouble side. So, where do you go? Answer: down. Right looked safest given other riders around me. I'm not sure about the visibility of oil on the track. By the exit of T1, my eyes were up, seeing bikes in strange places. Even after the wreck, we had to look around a bit to find the oil. Perhaps I came at a different angle and didn't see the sheen. And if red was flying at the next station, I'd probably have still turned the bike right to stay clear of following riders. It looked like the danger was to the left, and my responsibility was behind me. So, staying on the line appeared the most appropriate choice. Anyway, I'm not sure if there are lessons learned in this - maybe you'll find a nugget. Since then, I've been thinking a bit about ways to get information to riders. By no means is it STT's responsibility to dictate how the tracks manage themselves, but I've been noticing that many oval tracks have caution lights built in around the track. To Monte's story about nearly clipping someone in a red flag situation, it's be nice if the tracks had the means to give our track marshal one switch to turn everything red everywhere. But that's only going to cover a very small number of potential issues in a given year - can't say I've heard too many stories about injury following someone missing a red. Hope that helps put some questions to rest.
Holy Moses - this forum is by far the most dangerous part of the track day... save, perhaps, the corn dogs. To Brian's question about knowing why some made it through and others didn't: - Came around the outside of two bikes in T1. Was keeping an eye on the inside riders to make sure I gave them enough room on exit. - Saw a few bikes in the bailout straightaway, including one with smoke. Assumed... 1. someone messed up entry to T2 and a group went left to avoid a pile-up, and/or 2. someone blew a motor (may have been a 2-stoke up there making blue smoke) - Saw a bike down in the grass beyond T2. This advanced the current thinking - something went wrong in turn 2 and people bailed left. - T2 coming up quickly. Just passed guys on my left who are probably still close behind. Probably shouldn't cut left down the straightaway for fear of knocking someone else out. There was no way to know if someone was on my left rear trying to get the inside of T3. Can't make out whether there's oil to the left, anyway - that could be the trouble side. So, where do you go? Answer: down. Right looked safest given other riders around me. I'm not sure about the visibility of oil on the track. By the exit of T1, my eyes were up, seeing bikes in strange places. Even after the wreck, we had to look around a bit to find the oil. Perhaps I came at a different angle and didn't see the sheen. And if red was flying at the next station, I'd probably have still turned the bike right to stay clear of following riders. It looked like the danger was to the left, and my responsibility was behind me. So, staying on the line appeared the most appropriate choice. Anyway, I'm not sure if there are lessons learned in this - maybe you'll find a nugget. Since then, I've been thinking a bit about ways to get information to riders. By no means is it STT's responsibility to dictate how the tracks manage themselves, but I've been noticing that many oval tracks have caution lights built in around the track. To Monte's story about nearly clipping someone in a red flag situation, it'd sure be nice if the tracks had the means to give our track marshal one switch to turn everything red everywhere. But that's only going to cover a very small number of potential issues in a given year - can't say I've heard too many stories about injury following someone missing a red. Hope that helps put some questions to rest.
"To Monte's story about nearly clipping someone in a red flag situation, it'd sure be nice if the tracks had the means to give our track marshal one switch to turn everything red everywhere. " Circuit D' Catalunya has this function. When a red 'flag' is thrown, a series of triple red traffic lights get activated across the track in a few dozen locations. Very cool. 8)