Wow was that red flag out alot today. So many bikes sliding across the track. Every group had some. Was it the brisk fall air? Was it the thought of not being able to do another track day until next year? I happen to be watching the Novice group and noticed a very nice MV Augusta F4R. I thought - how cool for this owner to ride such a high end motorcycle at a track. Bam!! Down it goes - another victim. Intermediate had some aggressive riders. Over and over the 6' passing rule was being broadcasted to us as a fair warning. I had one incident that I blew a pass. I clearly ventured into the person ahead of me's racing line and came close. I felt really bad. Near the end of the day the Moto Gypsy (Control Rider) has my number for some reason. He made a very very close pass with his RC51 and gave me a abit of a surprise. I got abit upset and passed him down the straight. Then we had another incident at the bus stop where he attempted another very very close pass into my line. I have no idea why we were battling? At any rate I am home safely and my bike is home too in one piece. Cant wait for next year!! :lol:
Yeah there was a lot of incidents for certain...I was one of the slower Intermediate riders and man 6' passing rule was definately not being enforced.... But none the less... Saturday was a blast! -Z
Sunday had some paint rubbing and a nasty crash at the straight, in Intermediate... The rider was sent to the hospital. I hope he is okay!
Rider 414: Sometimes I find myself not braking hard into a turn and get passed. As that happens I usually follow the bike and watch their lines then pass them back if I can. If the rider is faster than me my hope is to follow a few turns and learn something. If you choose to pass the guy back, like your battle partner has done then he should have hauled off and leave you. Then the equation gets even more complicated with displacement. The liter bikes will try to out power my 600 on straits but I out brake them in and take more corner speed. Then the whole equation is even more complicated because your both in the intermediate group. Riding styles and confidence range greatly. My suggestion. do more track days and get into the advance group.
de - I like that in intermediate that ther is a 6' passing rule as I still need some time under my belt perfecting the line and getting use to being passed and passing. You are so right about following someone who just passed you. You can learn alot - like how much faster you can carry speed through certain area's :shock: I am worried that Ill be a huge boat anchor in Advanced. Those guys are insane fast. Good stuff!!
Yes. I didn't see the incident happen but the skid marks started right after the transition onto the new pavement and the rider ended up at least 150' from there.
I have seen a lot of riders "give the inside" there and then swoop over, and low and behold a rider took that space and ...contact. There is also a big bump there and you can highside all on your lonesome as well. Glad your friend is going to be ok, crashes there can be huge.
that looked terrible... I remember him still looking to be unconscious, by the time I was able to pit out and get over to the straight to see what happened. thanks for posting that info, Penthos. That's great news.
More like it. :roll: There's no excuse for taking someone else out, period. Glad the rider who was on the straight is ok.
I am glad that the guy is ok. And hopefully I don't get anyone angry and I am not trying to kick a guy when he is down. But I just don't understand the mindset of people sometimes. I wanted to wait a couple days before posting because this weekend was the first time in 5 years of coaching that while working with a student I've been hit by another rider and I don't understand why some people just seem to want to tear up their bikes or worse people. Yes it's a risky hobby but it doesn't have to be stupid. And the guy that hit me (who was lucky I couldn't find him) was stupid. There was no point to it. What is 1 freaking corner to wait to make a clean safe pass? This isn't a race or qualifying and everyone is entitled to enjoy the track...yes even the slow people. So for this guy to hit me just exiting the bowl is inexcusable because all he had to do was wait 10 feet and he would have had the sweeper to make a clean fast safe pass The irony of the guy in the video's crash in particular is that I had to speak to this guy earlier, for some aggressive riding he had done to me and a student I was working with and he ended up off the track (he didn't go down). At first he tried to debate it, but it's hard to debate something when well you end up off the track. The last thing I said to him is that you have to be careful because it's also for his own safety as well as others. So when I went out again I found him and tried to show him how to setup clean passes and I think he understood the point I was trying to get across. and he seemed to have calmed down a bit. So I was really bummed when I went to pick up the bike and saw it was him. The biggest problem I've seen and keep seeing is too many people simply do not have track awareness or "race craft" if you will. All they know is their line and they can go fast on it. Then they catch people and have no idea what to do so they just barge through thinking I'm fast and that's enough. I'm sorry that's not enough. Being fast is the easy part......being smart is what takes skill. This advice about rushing to get to advance group is the worst advice I keep hearing people give. If you don't know how to ride in the I group there is no way you belong in the advanced group. Sorry if I hurt anyone's ego, but that's just the truth. The real advanced riders aren't just fast they are smart and skilled. They can make passes at speed in an instant in close quarters and it's fun riding and learning with them. I think people really need to check their egos. Everyone has to learn and will make mistakes but you don't have to be stupid about it.
What you are referring to is “situational awareness†and to a certain extent something I call “on-track intuitionâ€. Allow me to explain.. Ever been driving along and on the freeway and there is the dolt who rushes to pass everyone and always gets blocked in? I’m like.. “Where in the heck is that guy going?†and then I just pass him? That person isn’t looking ahead and calculating flow and when gaps will become available, instead he blindly rushes into a situation from which there is no exit and gets boxed in. When we make a pass, rail thru a turn, come into a brakng zone, we are making a wager. Hat’s right, we are gathering all of the available data, calculating it (making odds) and then you are betting that you can make the pass/corner etc… The brain is a wonderful thing and not all are created equal when it comes to this talent. First and foremost, IMO the more hours you have spent in the seat, the more data (research) your brain can draw from to calculate odds and the more accurate the “bet†will be. Example, I have been coming up on a group and went to set up a pass and my brain calculates the odds and I check up for what seems no particular reason....Low and behold two seconds later SRCEEEEEEEEEEEEEEACH….BAM……CRASH!!! Now I would have been right in the middle of that had I tried the pass but my brain laid the odds and it wasn't a good bet. This is situational awareness and intuition. Some riders have a very keen sense of this, some a little and some none at all but the more you ride the better this should get. The single most important trait to go along with situational awareness is patience. Don’t rush into things. Scan and calculate, sometimes you have to hold off on passing one rider in turn three at Grattan so you can pass three coming out of four going into T5. This takes patience. What’s a better “bet†passing one rider on the outside of T3 (if he runs wide your screwed, if he crashes he takes you with him and if you pull it off you were going faster with more lean angle thus taking more risk…) or getting a good drive out of T4 and passing while straight up and down? Me? I’ll take hamburger “Bâ€. Ever notice there is the guy (you may know one) who is always “getting nearly run into, or bumped, or squeezed, etc..etc…? 95% of the time when I follow that guy it is HIS bizarre lines and unpredictable riding that are the problem NOT the other riders. Bottom line is that the best riders I know (and the ones who rarely fall down), THINK AHEAD and calculate every move while out on the track. This sport takes some brains. Anyone can go fast and fall down (some go slow and fall down too) but using your head is what keeps you on two wheels, out of trouble and having fun and at the end of the day we come to the track to have fun, plain and simple.
well said. i mean...for a guy that doesn't know what the hell you're talking about....sometimes your dribble is actually quality stuff.
and that is what I've been finding myself teaching and preaching over and over. I don't claim to be the fastest but I'm consistent and very aware. When the guy hit me exiting the bowl the first thing that crossed my mind was ….hell not another blown motor, because the rear reacted the same way. So when I checked up to get the bike back straight and warn the student I was working with I see the guy right on my but. Apparently he had cut the student off in the esses and maybe thinking I was going to fire out of the bowl. When I didn't ….well. If he had been paying attention it would have been easy to see the pace I was running with the student that we were not blazing out of the esses nor the bowl. And like you said which is the better option passing with little risk or more? 10 feet and he could have been gone cleanly without any problems. Another perfect example that paints a clear picture of this whole thing was a pass that Jake put on me in the bus stop. It was the same exact thing the guy on the CBR had tried to do and ran off the track even though I didn't force the issue. Jake came through the same pack of riders I had and we were on the inside tight. We basically went 3 wide into the bus stop with Jake in the middle and on the gas. He had enough time to give me a look and nod and I just laughed at the move because it was great. There was never a doubt in my mind that everyone was going to get out of the corner and was only pissed that I didn't have an answer for him as he walked away. It was completely different then the guy on the CBR who I knew right when he got beside me he wasn't going to make that corner …..and he didn't. Again I'm not trying to pick on the guy because after we spoke he seemed to understand the point I was trying to make. His friend came up to Sun morning and talked more about the whole thing again…so they were cool. But what happens is like Monte said, people lack patience. I see it time and time again, a rider will be trying to follow the rules and they slow up and wait to make a clean pass only to get jumped on by others thinking it's an opening. When I pull those guys off the track and speak with them, the first thing out of their mouths is "what did I do……" They'll usually say something about the other rider being unpredictable or shaky and that they wanted to get away because they were nervous. But I don't understand how spooking a rider that you admit you think is shaky is a smart or safe thing to do? I don't think guys like Jake, Todd, Siero, etc…. would run me as close as they do if they thought I was shaky……. anyway I don't know maybe I'm just too old because I don't get it. It sucks to crash but it's worse when the crash is the result of someone else's ego.
