need more food for thought...meaning, i better get to some stt events this year. i always go hungry during the frickin' silly season. :lol:
There's a reason I'm always bugging the crap out of you instructors.......You guys are really helpful. :wink: Wanna know a secret too. Last year was only my second year ever on a motorcycle. :shock: :shock: You guys have helped alot!!! Just thought I would sneak that info out.
another PRO for NESBA is their cancellation policy.." Once you have registered for a track day, you may cancel up to 15 days prior to the event without penalty, with the exception of a $5 processing fee. You can choose to have a full refund or credit applied to your account. If you cancel between 15 and seven days before an event, a full credit will be applied to your account, minus the $5 processing fee. If you cancel within seven days of the event, 100% of the track fee will be forfeited. " a CON for STT would be their cancellation policy.." Cancellations and changes MUST be received in writing at least 30 days prior to the scheduled course date. Upon receipt of this written notification, refunds will be given less a $50 administrative charge only if a cancellation request is received 30 days in advance in writing (email, fax or letter). Cancellations made between 30 and 15 days prior to an event will be granted a 50 percent credit for another track date useable within the same calendar year (credits can only be transfered one time) . No cancellations will be accepted 14 days or less prior to an event but you will have the option to transfer/sell your spot. "
Sorry, That policy regarding a $50 transfer fee is incorret. The plociy has not chnged from 2006 and will be fixed on the registration site ASAP.
Another pro for STT is the femal rider discount. Though it is no longer as much of a discount as it once was (what's up with that Monte?), when you are paying for two people every little bit helps. Depending on the track, it can make the difference between a day versus a track weekend.
the updated policy (or corrected policy) is much better. " Cancellations and changes MUST be received in writing at least 30 days prior to the scheduled course date. Upon receipt of this written notification, refunds will be given less a 5% administrative charge only if a cancellation request is received 30 days in advance in writing (email, fax or letter). Cancellations made between 30 and 15 days prior to an event will be granted a credit for another track date useable within the same calendar year (credits can only be transfered one time) . No cancellations will be accepted 14 days or less prior to an event but you will have the option to transfer/sell your spot. " it nice to be able to get credit for an event if cancelled 15 days before. i travel for work sometimes unexpectantly so this works out much better for me.
Here in the NE at Pocono the I group gets filled very fast and there can be spill-over to the A group, usually by people who tend to be a bit wreckless... This last season we started running 15 minute sessions for everyone and there are 2 I groups. It works really well and seemd to help a lot. I would still very much be in favor of having a formalized structure where people require approval by a CR to be bumped up from the N to the I group. And to go from the I to the A group require that 2 CR's agree to the bump. I ride in the A group with 4 clubs and STT has quite a large variation in riding abilities in the A group.
As the former Director of what I believe was the first track day organization East of California, our Reduc system was based on a system that appeared to be quite similar to Monte's and worked as well as possible. The class that a rider chooses to ride in is not neccessarily based on speed, but on that rider's comfort level riding within a given rule structure. We always had a few Novice riders that were indeed better (and perhaps faster) than a few of the riders in the Intermediate class, and we always had a few Intermediate riders that were indeed better (and perhaps faster) than a few of the riders in the Advanced class, but chose to remain in what most consider to be the "slower" class because the rules in that particular class made them feel more comfortable. It was the job of the Reduc staff (as it is now with the STT staff) to make sure that class selections have not caused any safety issues and make adjustments if neccessary. It's not a perfect system, but in my (humble <g>) opinion works as well if not better than any other. Track days are supposed to be fun and not run by the Gestapo. They are also different than racing as they aren't just about speed. Each and every rider has their own reasons for being on the racetrack that might differ from yours, and as long as they are able to ride in a way not to present a danger to anyone else in the class, it's our responsibility to safetly get around them within the rules of the class. In 1995 I did my first track day @ Mid Ohio and shared the track with three little kids on 125's who quite frankly, weren't going very fast, as it was one of their first stints on roadrace bikes, but they held perfect lines and were very consistant, so they weren't a problem at all; they happened to be brothers with the last name of Hayden. :lol: :lol:
That is Cool as Hell! Thanks to STT, I've been able to ride with Colin Edwards, Jamie James, & Kevin Schwantz, & meet Ben Spies & Matt Mladin.
This discussion is like beating a dead horse. Where is the beating the dead horse smiley guy? You have the STT die hards and you have the NESBA die hards. Then you have the inbetween people who don't care and just want to ride. Before I was asked to coach with STT (by K3) I chose STT because of the more layed back atmosphere. I found NESBA to be too up tight. I believe STT to be far superior to any track org especially because of the in class instruction. I think we can take it a step further with a simple power point presentation or by handing out simple notes explaining basic rider ediquette and simple points to help the newer track riders. We could even take it another step further and have some more advanced in class instruction once or twice a day to help the I and A groups. I understand that none of our staff is keith Code or Freddy Spencer, but lets be for real, there are no secrets to proper body position, and certain techniques to ride a motorcycle more efficiently and get around a race track faster.
I've never ridden with NESBA but I am going to give them a try this year. Just can't pass up on their $95 days/$175 weekends at Grattan. I also plan on trying Team ProMotion at Calabogie. It will be interesting to see how they compare to STT. Of the three groups I have ridden with, STT's Novice group is clearly the best. When deciding who Helise was going to do her first track day with we went with STT without hestitation. Once you move into Intermediate it gets a bit greyer. Each has its pros and cons. In the Advance group there isn't a lot difference between the different organizations. I only wish there were more non-weekend events (say, every Monday ), as they are less crowded (and I like 3 day weekends). Isn't that called the Pro School?
I consider it a con for NESBA. While some cancellation is good theirs is so loose people sign up early filling it then cancel on a whim. The last day at Barber in 06 was a good example. It was sold out for months then at the last second things freed up. I had a friend who drove to watch our group and would have ridden but was gone before cancellations started thus his bike was in Indiana.
I'll jump into this one: A couple of years ago I tried NESBA but quickly learned to hate their novice group's restrictive (and dangerous) "no passing a control rider unless waved by" rules. Even in the novice group, you can have vast differences in closing speeds. I'll never forget cresting the rise on the back straight at Road Atlanta running flat out behind an R6 and finding a control rider well off the pace working with a newbe. The R6 rider checked up hard (can't pass a control rider, you know!) and I almost gathered him up. On a straightaway, for crying out loud!! The next day, I saw a rider on the front straight lock the front and toss his bike trying to slow for another off-pace control rider working the intro group. Then a control rider rode off the track and took a spill at the top of hill turn 2-3 area simply because he was looking behind so much to "wave everyone by" That was enough of NESBA for me. STT only now.
The 'no passing the CR's rule' can indeed be a hassle, but I have found the majority of the NESBA CR's are constantly aware of people on their tail and will waive you through or will even lead you through traffic as needed. Although I find the quality of the NESBA CR's to be very good - it sounds like you had some bad experiences with perhaps lesser-quality CR's....
Go to the class... Talk to the track coaches... Learning how to race/ride a bike is not done in 1, 2 or 3 classrooms. It is a process that is different for everyone. Ask questions, participate, slow down to go fast. [/b]IT ALL BEGINS IN THE CLASS I've had intermediate and advanced riders ask me ?'s I've told them to sit in on the novice class. Most all come back and say thanks. It really is up to you... "Do you want to practice bad habits till they are perfect?" kc or do you want to practice good habits till they are perfect?